Getting off the grid

Scorpio1963

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Has anyone done anything like make a wind turbine or made their own solar panels for getting off the the electrical grid?I have been looking into this option for a while and thinking about making a wind powered generator.It would be perfect for these parts as part of climate change it seems to be alot windier than it used to be.
 
its happening all over the UK.

the govt have been supplementing households to mount solar panels on roofs and a special meter which puts electricity back into the national grid

wind turbines are everywhere
 
We have the wind turbines all over the place in ths states now,Also out in the west they are using mirror pannels to reflect light on a steam generator.Im wanting to make my own power system and hopefully enough to sell back to the utility cos cause by law they have to buy any excess electricity it makes.Freedon from the grid would be an awesome thing to have.No more dependance on the power companies plus your own private elctricty if the power goes out elseware you still have it.Electric co`s prices are expected to soar over the next few years.
 
even better if you have water stream higher up. Some stately homes have turbine generators and are really efficient
 
To be "off the grid" one needs to be able to produce, store, and deliver electricity on demand. 24 hours of every day, every week, every year. Without outside support of any kind. Not even fuel for a generator. This requires a fair bit of planning and investment in batteries and inverters that 99% of home installations do not have.

Selling surplus capacity is a bonus, but requires being on the grid and comes with a host of regulations and the inevitable income tax hassle. Believe me when I say that the local power company does not want you to do anything more than consume their product. Anything they say other than "use more!" and "pay us!" is probably a lie.

It is amazing how one has to change their habits when there isn't an unlimited supply of electricity available. If one is serious about being independent of the grid, steps can be taken today to reduce daily consumption of electricity, with the obvious reduction of the monthly electricity bill. But it requires a financial investment as well as a change of attitude. The latter is what gets most families. We have been trained to consume, and breaking free of that brainwashing is difficult...
 
Each jurisdiction approaches this differently. Scorpio's makes a utility buy power if someone has any to sell, but I am betting it does not subsidize it to the ridiculous extent that Ontariariario does.
In Ontario, one would have to be an idiot to go off the grid since the government pays up to 8 times the market value for solar or wind power, even if the grid doesn't need it at the moment. As a result, it often has to give away or pay US utilities to take the excess. Absolutely crazy.

Our cousins have a solar set up - likely on the same program that regvenne's system is on. They sell 100% of what they generate at up to 8x the market price and then they buy 100% of what their household uses at the market rate. If they actually used any of their own power, it would simply cost them money to do so. When their $90,000 system was first installed, they had the option of using their own power first and then only selling the surplus for up to 8x. Luckily for them, they did not fall for that trick and are, instead, making out like bandits.

As a friend, I admire them (and regvenne) for seeing the opportunity and making the investment - and I wish I had been tuned in and had followed their example. But as a taxpayer and citizen, I am outraged that such a boondoggle could ever have occurred and I believe the party responsible for this waste of tax dollars will be voted out of office. Our Hydro rates have gone from the cheapest in the country to the most expensive. We are losing industry and new investment (and new jobs) as a result of prohibitively high rates. It is good for the individuals who were smart enough to jump in at the beginning, but it is bad for the economy and the tax base in the long run and we will all rue the day, I think.

And that's without even getting into the discussion about how ugly the wind turbines are.
 
Why get off the grid when you can supply power back into the grid, and get payed for the power you supply.
When I looked into purchasing the battery system, I realized that it was not worth the investment.
 
There are systems out there that I have been looking into that make it affordable for the average person and easy to make with out being complicated.Why get off the grid?I dont know if you were affected by the blackout in 2003 but I had no electric for 4 days.It was summer and we were having hotter than normal temps which meant no ac no refrigerated food latern light ,literaly back in the stone ages.It will probaly happen again and I dont ever want to be nulnerable like that ever again.
As what lou says about it thats crazy but Ontario is not alone.The US will experience the same outrages price increases.Not sure if its like this in Ontario Lou but we actualy ge incentives to make our own power especialy if its part of the so called green movement.
 
I agree with both of you, I think I would go off the grid if the batteries would have a much longer life span, and there price would be greatly lower.

When I looked into batteries a few years ago, there life span was averaging 5 to 8 years. Now for me I would need 10 to 15 batteries. Not worth the investment.

Good luck Scorpio1963.
 
Supposedly there are plans to make wind powered generators for under $1000 US $.Cant remember all the details but the system produces another stored electricity for up to 3 days.
 
its happening all over the UK.

the govt have been supplementing households to mount solar panels on roofs and a special meter which puts electricity back into the national grid

When did they start having sun in UK?

:D
 
This spring we havent had much sun here in this great state of Michigan (So they say)Its rains for 3-4 days then you get 2 days of ptly sunny as harra 1 day of sunny skys
 
I hear what you are saying about the incentive programs and the investment oppurtunities. And a part of me thinks that it is great. A small part. The rest of me realizes that it is not sustainable and that it will collapse under its own weight. I mean, when have you ever heard of buying high and selling low, or giving it away, being a valid business model??? Only a socialist government could do something so stupid. And only brainwashed taxpayers would support it...

My other beef with these systems is that when the grid goes down, as it does, one has all this generating capability that can't be accessed or stored. What good is it then? None at all is my answer. I have been through long term blackouts, and I have heard from those who have have 'profiteering' solar systems. The food in their fridge and freezer spoiled just like mine would have, if I didn't have a generator.

For me, it will be a self sustaining system, or nothing at all. I don't want the handouts anymore than I want to handout my earnings...
 
It's true that at the moment, solar panels have only just passed its energy break even point. That is, the entire development and production of solar panels, with all research involved and the energy consumed with producing panels, it has, up until a few weeks ago, cost more energy than it delivered. And of course, it's by far not economic yet. But what you're forgetting is that it will be.

A place where this technology has proven very successful, is on places 'off the grid'. Think about small ocean sail boats, log cabins in remote places. Generating power far from civilization is quite useful, and solar panels are perfect for this.

In 'normal' homes, the benefits are small at the moment. Yes, you'll save on your monthly power bill, but you need to invest quite a sum of money to be independent from the grid. And yes, at night you would need another source of energy, or you need a battery system. And all battery systems are pretty low in efficiency and capacity, and very environmentally unfriendly. Putting power back in the grid can be done, but is often tricky and hard to get money from. But governments promote it, since it's still a favorable source of energy compared to burning coal or other fossil fuels which have larger impact on the environment.

And what people often forget is that oil and gas is inevitably going to get more expensive. I'm in the oil business, and I can tell you that there is still a lot of it around. But the problem is that it's in countries which are not so eager on sharing (read: middle east and russia). Nonetheless, as we use up the 'easy' oil we can get our hands on, prices are going to go up, because oil will become more scarce. And harder to produce, which will drive up the price as well. That will make solar/wind/biomass or other renewable energies a lot more attractive.

But we can't sit around and wait for the price to skyrocket without developing the renewables. That would be catastrophic, once fuel prices go up there won't be much time to develop everything.

So, that's why there is an incentive to promote the use of these sources of energy. And then you can call your government stupid, socialist, or whatever, but you're the one that's not seeing the whole picture.
 
Very well put willem. The large incentives are to get the industry going. Imagine if there were no incentives what so ever. No one would try to develop renewable energy resources because they would be far to expensive. Also I think incentives on a macro are just as important as they are on a micro level. These incentives make people less dependent on big energy companies, and I dont know about you but I like the sounds of that.

In the long run no the government cant afford to buy energy for 8x its worth but for the time being it is a good idea to cut our dependence on oil.
 
On a sarcastic note instead of using ethanol in our gas why dont they use for power production.Of course this is all going to depend on the growing of crops that ethanol is produced from.With climate change and drouts and grain belt moving northward into canada ethanol maynot have a very long sustainable future.Plus theres the big debate should we use a food source to make ethanol in the first place.Back before radical shifts in the climate it would have been feasible but not now.
 
To produce a gallon of ethanol it costs more than a gallon of fossil fuels according to some studies I have looked at. In my personal opinion ethanol is a joke until they can manufacture more effciently.
 
They are using so many different types of plants corn,soy beans,sugarcane,algea which all depnd on water which is becoming a scarce comody in alot of this country.They just built an E 85 refinery not far from where I live.Im not sure whats being used to make the fuel but it sure isnt making any electricity only using it.We have enough strain on our power grid as it is.As for the our nations power grid the infrustructure of it is crumbling.Compared to other countries that have updated their power grids the US is far behind.I beleive the time is now so Im not left in the dark when it crumbles.
 
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