NEW clutch & kickstart problems

[FUBAR]

so i have a dillemma, im trying to wrap up loose end and get this bike going for THIS summer.

1: i put the front sproket cover on and hooked up the clutch cable but the clutch is wayy too soft and has no spring action back. it doesnt feel like its disengauging the clutch either

2: the kickstart moves down freely and there is no feeing of compression, like its turning the engine over.it just moves down and it springs back up by itself.


yet the engine runs nicely with the electric start. ive never ridden this bike so maybe im missing somthing easy.

anybody have any suggestions, i did rebuild the engine, and didnt have any parts left over

 

[Greasey Fingers]

Check out this great thread for the bottom end, I used it heaps when I was pulling it apart and putting back together it was very helpful: http://www.xs400.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5558

Hang on thats your thread

When you put it together was the kickstarter engaging, you tested it before you put the cases back together im guessing? I found that the kickstarter only really engages in the last part of the kick. I had a good look at the mechanics of it before I put the cases back together, specifically the kickstsrter because it always felt like it wasnt engaging properly. The nature of the mechanism was sometimes it would grab sooner or later depending on where the teeth are in the revoloution of the kick. Does the kickstarter start the bike at all?

Mine still behaves the same as before I rebuilt the bottom end, so Im guessing its just the way it is. It seems to grab at the last part of the kick. It works fine though, my bike starts first kick everytime as long as it has fuel in the carbs.

Also with the clutch, I have not been able to undo the little ajustment bolt in the sprocket cover (is that the actuater or something) so basically with that little worm drive thingy, I had to put it so it doesnt go into its housing all the way. It sits out about a quarter the way. After I did that the clutch worked great, its not ideal but its not going to break anything either. I just have to get the little ajustment bolt undone, then I can set it up properly!

 

[ThePsuedoMonkey]

When I got my bike, the kick would only engage at the very bottom of the kick. I think that it was not installed properly before (you can put it in half a rotation off and not know it without paying attention), because now it is awesome. Maybe this is the same issue? I would check the position of the innermost gear, since that is where my problem seemed to be. As for the clutch, if it doesn't retract I would assume the cable is not tight enough.

 

[drewpy]

the kicker and clutch are related.

without the clutch working, you have no kicker as it needs it to be engaged to transfer to the crank.

 

[FUBAR]

thanks for the responses guys.

my clutch cable is too long and therefore doesnt pull enough to drive the worm gear > to push the clutch rod (?) as of now.

with no pressure on the clutch rod from the cable, is that enough to mess with the k-start?


the k-start seems to function smoothly and springs back nicely, just no compression or engine turning.

i know you mentioned that to me before drewpy that the cover has to be on ect.


get a shorter cable and it should work once theres pressure on the worm gear/rod?

 

[ThePsuedoMonkey]

I went back to the pics of my rebuild, but correct me if I'm wrong:
The kick goes to a gear on the output shaft of the transmission (which I assume spins freely), then to the input shaft, directly to the inner clutch basket and clutch plates, to the clutch pads via friction, directly to the outer clutch basket, to the crankshaft. If you can't disengage the clutch, then the kick should work fine. Maybe the springs aren't compressing the clutch, so that it is always disengaged, and making it seem like the cable isn't working? That's the only single cause that I can come up with. Other than that, try to recall how you oriented the kick gear (In my first thread I mentioned that I installed it so that the "key" is in the 6 o' clock position... I'm sure it made sense at some point) and if you put the ball bearing on the end of the push rod.

 

[FUBAR]

hmm, im not sure im gonig to start with the cable and go from there. i cut holes in the cover so i can actually see that the cables not pulling it, hopefuly that fixes both, if not i rip the side cover off again

 

[dO-bOy]

I think the cable is the culprit my friend. Pretty sure drewpy is right as usual because on our bikes, if the clutch is in,the kick is disengaged too. I found the out the hard way thinking my kick was broken when I subconsciously was holding the clutch lever

 

[drewpy]

so long as there is no pressure on the clutch rod and the clutch itself is fine, the kicker should turn the engine over.
If you have put the kicker on wrong or the casting inside the crankcase has broken (it happens) then that will stop the engine turning over too.

 

[FUBAR]

ok so i got the clutch adjusted correctly and feels firm and it seems to work. however the kickstart still is not right. i cant remember right can i access the k start gears from the side cover or do i have to split the case

 

[ThePsuedoMonkey]

You can get at 'em with just that side cover off.

 

[drewpy]

.........and the oil drained

 

[HoughMade]

.........and the oil drained

Shush! That could have been fun....for us.

 

[FUBAR]

haha and i just topped 'er up too!

 

[ThePsuedoMonkey]

.........and the oil drained

My bad, I figured that would be implied

 

[drewpy]

My bad, I figured that would be implied

It certainly would be expletive

 

[FUBAR]

i got a pm regarding what the outcome of the kickstart problem was:

i took the kick side cover off and found the the torsion spring tang was not correctly seated in the ressesed divot in the case where it should be.

i removed everything and reassembled in the order which haynes manual outlines and made sure to seat the spring tang in the correct spot. the manual doesnt go into much detail on this. works like new now and fires well