Grrr batteries and other general morning evil bike syndrome!

[markjs]

OK, I'll try and keep this short but Frankenbike decided to hate me this morning and I think the answer is likely complicated. Anyway, the battery I was using went back to the guy who gave it to me (he changed his mind and made a gift into a loan when he needed it), so I got two batteries from the other 400. One is too big like the one I was using but is solid. I actually modified my side cover just a bit to make it fit (oh well there goes stock!)

The other battery, the one that fits, charges right up, looks good at 13 volts (my charger isn't automatic so it overshot a bit), but it barely turns the engine. If it's warm it's fine to start, but I don't think this battery is capable of cold starting the bike. No signs of bad sulfate deposits either. I'm wondering, is the stock battery too wimpy for the bike?

Worse yet, water is getting into my crankcase I think. I really don't understand it but this morning I didn't park it in the barn and it went "blub blub blub" as it turned over. There was enough water in the exhaust to make noise. Even in the summer, where I live every morning is freezing or near freezing and every morning even with an RV battery, that engine turns over like frost is on the inside of the cylinder, it's weird! It always takes a few cranks before it starts turning over at any speed fast enough to start it. Anyone have any idea what might cause that?

In any case, got it started, it never shot out a gout of water but it always steams a bunch in the morning. I'm just kind of frustrated and baffled, especially since I busted and had to repair a side cover because I forgot part of it mounts on the tank. (HORRIBLE design Yamaha, SHAME!)

 

[Scorpio1963]

Your running 20w50 oil in your bike right?If so you are going to need to keep that crankcase warm to start your bike.

 

[markjs]

10w40 currently, and I've never seen oil cause this.

 

[Scorpio1963]

Have you rejetted your carbs at all?I know last year I struggled with my bike in cold weather to get it started.It wasnt that the battery didnt have enough cranking amps it was brand new.I have noticed since I enlarged my fuel jets my bike acts like a completely different machine.

 

[markjs]

No, I mean it's not cranking over fast as it should. The bike runs fine, just the battery that is supposed to fit won't turn it fast enough and I don't get it.

 

[Scorpio1963]

Seem like to me the battery just doesnt have enough cranking power?Have tryed kick starting the bike?

 

[drewpy]

tried your earth and positive connections?

all needs to be metal to metal, not rust to dust

 

[16VGTIDave]

Connect a volt meter to the battery and crank it over. If the voltage drops below 8 volts the battery is shot. If the voltage is 10 or higher, check your wiring. A poor engine ground can cause these symptoms.

Steam from the exhaust is normal on a cold start with the "choke" on and cool air.

Blaming Yamaha for your error is nothing more than denial. You broke the side cover, plain and simple. It might help you feel better if you kicked the bike like Scorpio suggested...

 

[markjs]

It's a bad design and I'll stand by that. Never seen a side cover go through a part like a tank that has to come on and off so often. Yeah it's my fault but it's still a lousy design and nothing you can say will budge me from that position. I fixed it anyway, but have a feeling it won't be the last time I fix it. Just dealt with so many bikes it's almost reflex to yank the tank in a hurry. I did bolt it down this time so maybe I will remember..

It rolls over just fine but it's not cold now so no way to know. The battery is good and the ground seems fine, I think it just doesn't have as much cranking amps as the other battery. I guess I'll find out tomorrow if I can run with the small battery or not.

 

[Scorpio1963]

I wish i could tell you how many cranking amps my battery has but without running over to my storage again I dont know.I know its cranking power in cold weather doesnt last very long so if the bike doesnt start right away it will die out quickly.Like as mentioned try kick starting the bike it doesnt take as much power from the battery.Just for the heck of it is it easy on your bike to remove the starter cover and peak around in there?Maybe the wiring is corroded.

 

[markjs]

Nope, DOHC = No kickstart! They should have kick starts on ALL bikes!

 

[Scorpio1963]

A gree with ya markjs

 

[markjs]

I begin to think it's just another design flaw (yes, our bikes are awesome but many things can be done better), because come to think of it, every bike I have had with the small size battery like this wears out after just a few cranks if the bike won't start. This other battery is like not even half a centimeter taller and maybe 1cm or less wider, but it has SO much more cranking power, but the side cover needs extra long screws and the top lip cut off to run with a decent battery. I am giving this little one one more chance but if it gives me trouble tomorrow, I am running with the big one permanently. Another thing I remember is these little ones always burning up quick, but this next size larger battery with the screws that go down, seem to last and last.

 

[Scorpio1963]

Even the guys who ride harleys have problems with their batteries diing pretty quick so we are not alone with our small bikes.

 

[Charles]

Blaming Yamaha for your error is nothing more than denial. You broke the side cover, plain and simple. It might help you feel better if you kicked the bike like Scorpio suggested...

 

[Scorpio1963]

I will say that there are some faulty designed parts on our bikes and probaly with other makes as well.No matter what it is someone will find something that they consider faulty.Example on the Xs400 sohc.The battery box is a pia to remove.Yu have the wrestle it ut the side instead of it just sliding up from the top.To me its a stupid design flaw.It makes very difficult to remove the carbs and airtubes.Well not on my bike.I did some chopping and modded it to where it will slide up and only takes about 5 minutes to get my carbs off and put the airtubes together easily.

 

[Lou Ranger]

Mark. I have an '84 Maxim which should be the same as yours. My side covers just snap on and off as easy as can be. Are you talking about the black covers with the word "Maxim" in gold which are underneath? I have to admit I haven't had to remove the tank yet so don't know about the lettered ones being attached. I have taken the right one off in order to remove the battery.

My battery seems to be a very large sized one and when it was newer, it would turn things over easily. On these cold mornings when the 15w oil is settled and thick, I have taken to jumping with a spare 12v car battery. Once the bike is warmed up even a little bit, the weak battery has no problem turning it over and starting it virtually instantly.
I will NEVER use Rotella in the spring or fall again unless they formulate a 10w40 or, better yet, a 5w40. Maybe 15w will be okay in hot summer months but saving a couple of bucks on oil only to prematurely wear out your battery or starter is false economy.

 

[markjs]

No it's the tank. The side covers on my bike have tabs that go into a hole on the bottom of the tank, so that if you take the tank off you will tear one of the pegs off the side cover and it broke with almost no resistance at all (unobtanium is very fragile), the tank came off and I didn't even know I broke anything. I had to drill a hole in my side cover and put a tiny screw into the peg that goes into the tank glue to give the super glue I used to glue the pieces together real strength. A bit of JB weld putty and a magic marker and it will look dam near good as new (it's really a small hole), if I even go that far. It's just a silly unnecessary way to design it as far as I am concerned, I doubt it was intentional (being as they never made replacement side covers AFAIK), but it still is dumb in hindsight I think.

 

[willem]

I had alot of trouble with my previous battery as well. 4 weeks after buying it (brand new) it would turn the engine over for about 3 seconds after being fully charged, but it would never fire it up. I sent it back to the manufacturer and got my money back, and bought a new battery from a different brand. Also cheap. Since then never any issues, I forgot to put on my choke the other day and tried starting about 20 times in half an hour before realizing. But no problem at all for my battery. I was amazed how strong they can actually be.

 

[markjs]

Well it's 2am but I dropped off so early (was tied, working on the bike will do it to me), that I think I'll go out and try and fire her up and see how it goes. That way when it's time to leave I know before hand!